Hello,
So I usually don't bother posting too much about new releases not pertaining to my armies...but I am a bit fearful of the newest thing from Games Workshop. So lets start that from a fluff perspective I love the Imperial Knights. They are fun, exciting, and a cool breadth of fresh air. However...as T.O's look at this new book I hope they will look past the "D weapons will end death stars thought process" because...no they won't. Anyone who thinks that is pretty much a fool...we have had deathstar 40k since I started playing warhammer back in 3rd edition and its not going anywhere. What we WILL HAVE is deathstar 40k + a bunch of imperial knights. So to start...we shall have a sample list I just created which...would be quite rude.
Farseer (shard of anaris, both runes, bike, spear)
Farseer (soulshrive, both runes, bike, spear)
Baron Sathonyx
Beast pack (5 beast masters, 20 kyhmeras, 2 razorwing flocks)
5x3 windrider jetbike squads
1x5 kabalite warrior squad
2x Knight Paladin
So this....This is a pretty standard beast-star list which literally lost nothing except it exchanged its old heavy support units for 2 Imperial Knights...so you come across this army..which was already nearly un-killable and quite annoying except now the OTHER deathstars which did at least provide counters for it are no longer even a concern...because you simply throw a Knight into the other deathstar and even if the other deathstar kills your Knight...when the Knight explodes it will take out most of the that death-star with it. So given that example I am sure you readers can all come up with other silly lists that also abuse this new detachment (I cant wait to see the space marine centurion death stars taking an Imperial Knight as well) All we are doing by using this new "codex" is forcing all the players to go out and buy 1-3 Knights...It won't change anything. We will still be playing death-star 40k...so honestly I suggest we just leave the Imperial Knight Codex at home...the codex doesn't need to be banned...that's wrong..simply continue with what we are doing at events and say, "No units with D-Weapons are allowed." But if we allow un-restricted use of this new unit then I do think it would be unfair to continue disallowing the usage of other Titans and such. Personally I think Codex: Imperial Knights should be reserved for events that use Escalation and Stronghold Assault. It really isn't that the unit itself is too crazy strong...it just seems dumb to me that the already very powerful armies get these things...and the other weak armies get nothing.
Another silly list:
Farseer (shard of anaris, both runes, bike, spear)
Farseer (both runes, bike, spear)
Baron Sathonyx
8x warlocks on bikes (2x spears)
4x3 windrider bike squads
1x5 kabalite warrior squad
2x Knight Paladin
Or how about:
Iron Hands:
Chapter master (bike, shield eternal, thunder hammer, artificer armor)
2x5 scouts
1x4Centurion Devastators (grav cannons, sergeant with twin linked las and omniscope)
Ultramarine allies:
Tigurius
1x5 scouts
Inquisition Allies:
Coteaz
Xenos Inquisitor (rad grenades, psychotroke grenades, liber heresius, 3x servo skulls)
Imperial Knight Allies:
2xKnight Paladin
So...I'd like to know how the addition of this extra detachment changes deathstar 40k..? I mean you send your Knights into your opponents knights...abuse charging through cover rules to keep your deathstar from getting really charged by the enemy knights...and then use your deathstar to kill the meager amount of other stuff your opponent has...I like the Knights I really do...I just don't see how they solve any problems..I think they merely continue to aggravate an already bad situation. It just seems like the already annoying abusive armies will just take them (I know I probably will go pick up a pair of them if I get the green light from a few major events).
Anyway..I am sure I will post up more thoughts in the next week or so...but I want to close with this.
I really do like that Games Workshop is giving us so much more to play with...but just as the warmachine community does for competitive play...we can as a community continue to allow/disallow on an event by event basis whatever we want. Just because GW says you CAN use something, does not mean you HAVE to use it.
-Farseer Tsarith
(PS I am sure those are not the MOST abusive lists they are just what I came up with after my first look through of the codex, I have not compared the two Knight variants much I just picked the more expensive one for my theory lists)
Welcome,
I am Farseer Tsarith and I have been playing Warhammer 40k for about 14 years. I play in most of the major events in and around the DC area and I frequent Huzzah Hobbies in Sterling, VA. My main passion is my Eldar force which I have been growing since the tail end of 3rd edition. I generally post about events I will be attending, upcoming DC area events, my event results, and of course sometimes just my random thoughts and musings.
-Farseer Tsarith
I could be wrong (don't have the book, won't buy the book,won't give GW my money anymore) but I believe the Knights count as your Ally...they're not just a detachment, but your ally.
ReplyDeleteThat being said, I agree with you completely. Adding more stupid stuff will not help balance things..it will just create more stupid imbalance.
Its buried a few more pages in on page. But you can take it as your primary detachment. When you do you take 3-6 Knights and they all become scoring units. I played a few test games with them...they are not crazy over the top. I think after some thought I am just more nervous about the "well we are using Imperial Knights so lets just use all the apocalypse stuff too..." Honestly Bob you should be fine just use those telekinesis powers you never use when you play against them...fly around and strip some hull points off them! Seriously though this specific model is actually quite fine with me...I just fear its going to trend toward D-Weapon shooting which will be silly since when you have D weapon guns positioning no longer matters. The game becomes purely about who brought more D weapons and who goes first.
ReplyDeletemy point is if they're the primary, then you can't take DE and Eldar; you can't take IH and UM; of course you can still throw in some Inq, but that's less painful than full seer-council + knights. :)
ReplyDeleteOh no they are also a seperate allied detachment. In the chart it shows primary, regular allied, then special Imperial Knight detachment which allows 1-3 knights. You can have that AND an inquisitor detachment...and formations. I dunno I would like to see us play 40k where you can have 1 primary army, and a secondary army which can be filled by a normal ally, one of these special ones (knights/inquisitorial), or you can take a single formation.
ReplyDeleteYeah Matt did it right. I agree with all the points Matt made, in this main post and in the comments. This army is bad-news for 40k in general. GW is basically going "to hell with our own rules" and tossing them aside.
ReplyDeleteThe powerful armies are now more powerful, and the crummier armies have to suck it harder. The worst part is you can't even meta to beat knights, because if you do, their acommpanying deathstar will eat you.
I stand corrected, though I'm not happy about it.
ReplyDeleteI'm particularly grumpy because Daemons have very little to deal with AV12 from range...if I need to kill it, I have little choice but to trade units: and in fact really several units as a single DP or Screamer unit has little chance of killing one in a single combat round. Very sad.
Am I the only one that sees this as (another) blatant cash-grab?
Ya. I dunno man, they are slow (due to moving max 6 in/through terrain). I think for the most part an army of them isnt too great but 1-2 of them well used could be problematic for many current builds. The good news is I just played against one and due to the size of its base...when it blows up you can actually be in base to base with it and not get hit by the strength D portion of the blast unless it scatters onto you. (It uses a base that is a size up from the wraithknight ovals)
ReplyDelete